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Cape can’t afford to buy golf course

October 18, 2013

To the editor: I recently read that Councilman Chulakes-Leetz wants to have the city buy the old golf course. I believe the cost is somewhere around $12 million....

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(35)

grabital

Oct-24-13 10:33 AM

Your right Lolita, the subject of the golf coarse is slipping by. Have not heard from anyone about the councilman's thought about buying this property. I hope its not a sleeping nightmare that will spring up like "Fast and Furious" and be shoved down our throats and a new tax to pay for it.

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Lolita

Oct-23-13 7:29 PM

Here we go. The LTE is about the golf course and we are doing the corned beef and hash about Kessler. Really reaching back. What does the purchase or not of the golf course have to do with the audit? Switch is switching to change the subject again. Curious Sullivan mentioned Kessler at Civic. HMMMMMMMMMMM.

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lightswitch

Oct-23-13 2:49 PM

Why would a city council NOT want to know the findings of the outside consultant they voted to come in to perform the audit.

It did not make sense at the time and still doesn't make sense today.

What was that council afraid of in going after MWH a subsidiary of Haliburtion, Inc.?

Haliburton was known to have even gone so far as overcharged the United States military for the number of meals they served. They overcharged the military on huge amounts of fuel for military aircraft and land vehicles, during the Iraq war. Why they even were sued in the huge water/sewer UTILITIES PROJECT in Jefferson County, Alabama. But then so was J P Morgan Bank that settled with the Feds in court to the tune of $730 million for paying friends of the politicians there checks that were passed on to those politicians as bribes. "Pay to Play" Another too big to fail corporation? They paid big settlements.

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lightswitch

Oct-23-13 2:27 PM

$60,000 was spent on the Kessler. When Sullivan was mayor.

In fact JIM BURCH was on that council and Eric P. Feicthaler was mayor, Gloria Tate, Dolores Bertolini, Tim Day, Derrick Donnell. They had originally requested Kessler to investigate MWH formerly Brown Root part of the Haliburton Corporation. Kessler was not made by that council after that money was spent even asked questions about the findings. There is probably a reason for that as well. If it ever got out the city let MWH write the contract with things like the city paying for damaged valves and other supplies that were never put in use but paid for. Or the fact that the city supervision over the Contractor MWH and or its subcontractors on the project was next to none. The city staff was over its head and it had JIM BURCH's comnpany that he owned at the time doing design work on the project. After that project I guess it was time to sell that company Burch owned with the city as its biggest customer.

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CapeCoralCuestions

Oct-23-13 3:18 AM

Litwich/LIAR Let’s talk about the money the RAGs spent on Kessler, let’s talk about Sully claiming fraud, and other illegalities and almost getting the City sued for slander/libel. OR about Sully and Dillie suing the city and trying to ram through a settlement 3 days before Christmas? OR about King hiring two pals as ‘special’ consultants to help him with his job? OR their pay? Cost of paying Lee County for the fuel audit that proved nothing? Cost of feeding their wives at citizens expense? Can we talk about ala King running rough-shod over and terrorizing city staff, citizens and anyone else he felt like? Talk about a nasty man. King called a gentleman and left on tape how he was going to ‘get’ the guy, and private meetings with RAGs on Council (Sunshine Violation) at Ruby Tuesday after council meetings? How about Pete Brand calling a strip club in Fort Myers on his city phone? What of the drunken Dillie dunk of the mayor? Or Dillie stealing campaign signs from City Hall?

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lightswitch

Oct-21-13 2:15 PM

And if youy took the $4.5 million and as google shows in the article. That amount of 4-1/2 million dollars was borrowed by a BOND for 15 years. Figuring the the interest rates around April 3009 in midst of the finance crunch the interest rate over 15 years would bring the total 4.5 million to about $10,000,000 when the bond is paid off.

You see when you are indebted the longer you owe the balance the more it ultimately costs. Now shall we discuss general obligation bonds?

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Raydunavant

Oct-21-13 11:33 AM

Electrician,

Thanks for the correct information. I refuse to respond to lightswitch as he is on my "too stupid to comment upon" list, also known as my fecal roster!

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Angelsonly

Oct-21-13 10:58 AM

The cost of under grounding the transmission lines was 4.5 million dollars. NOT 10 mil.

The Tax increment funds the CRA receives are repaying the 4.5 million dollar bond.

At least know what you all are talking about before you type false info. The Old Golf Club is indeed in the CRA as are thousands of single family homes within the CRA expansion area #2.

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Lolita

Oct-21-13 10:04 AM

In addition, Electrician, the truth and only the truth.

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Lolita

Oct-21-13 10:03 AM

Electrician.

Where have you been? Welcome. The trust, finally. Switch off, switch.

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Electrician

Oct-21-13 9:39 AM

Lightswitch = revisionist

The city guaranteed the loan that the CRA is repaying from its revenue.

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Lolita

Oct-20-13 12:21 PM

Put in a records request at the City and your questions will be answered. Careful on this site...not all telling or complete info is ever here.

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grabital

Oct-20-13 10:48 AM

To Grumpy 19

to Grunpy19, Good question, "What about the city owned property given to the now missing developer for a parking garage?" Is it still his,if so, is he paying taxes ?

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lightswitch

Oct-19-13 9:10 PM

balconies. Also it was conceivable those electric wire would be only 8 feet away from a balcony presenting a potential electrocution. I also at that time posted the looks of having large concrete poles on the sidewalks with wires strung through that area would not be eye appealing and cheapen the look people would want to invest their money in. Bottom line the city owes the CRA $10 million...when it gets a developer to build to a scraped plan. There is much more to this regarding plans looking like I described to Key West looks and as always there are people involved who were just biding their time, running separate companies with city clients and hired with no background in a multimillion dollar project.

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lightswitch

Oct-19-13 8:58 PM

jcmckayfl If you check the archives of this paper or the NP the CRA had the $10 million in their account from taxes.

The city was tight for revenues this was in 2011. The city had gone round and round with Lee County Electric to run high tension poles in wires from the substation at Everest for 10 years (2000). Lee County Electric offered the lines underground then did not want to do it. However the decision was finally made giving LCEC the ability to run those lines south under ground and underwater to Sanibel to give them more electrical stability. The city needed to come up with $10 million it did not have so it was offered by the then CRA Director as a loan. You see CRA had stagnant money in its fund. There was a developer in the mix who showed drawing of a Northern European themed downtown. Retail ground level, office and live space on upper floors. The Fire Chief at that time if the high tension lines were on poles his trucks in an emergency could not get to the upper

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lightswitch

Oct-19-13 8:43 PM

seandhartman I only agree with you because some cities have capable administrators and ironclad accounting systems to be in businesses.

I believed at one time Cape Coral was capable. Time and history have proved this to be folly. Cost of personnel is too costly comparing the private sector market, employees do not have either the fear or the respect of their employer. The benefits and pensions have shown us these types of ventures can't even break even let alone generate a surplus over costs. So I agree with you Cape Coral has no business in golf, water park, or anything else that resembles free enterprise. Leave the city to own the land buildings and just collect the rent. (They have a problem even figuring out what a lease is worth). It also shows Community Development Dept. can't even find a developer or buyer for the golf course or a hotel to make it a destination property in FLORIDA. That is why we have paid the big bucks to people that come do nothing and leave.

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lightswitch

Oct-19-13 8:27 PM

Where is the CRA's $10 million dollars the city borrowed to put the electric utilities underground?

Don't tell me the city manager did not figure any of the repayment to the CRA budget for the $10 million or any part of it. What was the term of that loan?

Szerlag you gonna have some splanin to do! And the $6.5 million for road resurfacing not put in the budget! What else is not in the budget? We know there was a 5% bonus based on the base salaries of every city employee.

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grumpy19

Oct-19-13 3:09 PM

I could be wrong about the golf course. It is within the CRA boundaries. It is privately owned just as other properties in the CRA.

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grumpy19

Oct-19-13 2:53 PM

go look at the map of the CRA. That entire area is in the CRA. Everything within the boundaries of the CRA is included according to the map of the CRA. The homes are privately owned but are included in the CRA.

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Lolita

Oct-19-13 11:27 AM

The Golf course is not in the CRA. It is privately owned. There is property that abuts the golf course that was moved into theCRA.

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grumpy19

Oct-19-13 10:21 AM

Here's a little secret you people seem to have forgotten. The old golf course is part of the CRA. It has to be the CRA that would buy it and they have no money. They need to pay back the city for the undergrounding of the power lines, in which the city lent the CRA the money. As someone stated already. We got screwed by the developer that pushed the undergrounding. His project will never be built. What happened to the land given to the developer for a parking garage that the city owned?

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grabital

Oct-19-13 9:33 AM

To JCMCKAYFL, I also think the CRA at the time did borrow the 10 mil for this underground project with the idea that a developer would build a high rise type of building downtown but wouldn't until the exposed wires were buried. So we buried the wires and the developer turned and ran off with the CRA's dream. Thankfully the city dis-banded the old CRA "spend as they wish board" and took it over. Still no downtown major projects, only a few more restaurants. The city must tighten the belt on spending, not getting into the golf business.

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jcmckayfl

Oct-18-13 9:48 PM

Liteswitch, you said "I do know the city borrowed $10 million from the CRA to underground electric utilities in the CRA district". I believe it was the other way around. The City borrowed the money to the CRA and they had to pay the City back. I might be wrong but I do not believe so.

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1sandy

Oct-18-13 4:46 PM

If putting a golf course and hotel there would bring revenue to the City, why then did the golf course and hotel that was there, GO OUT OF BUSINESS? Too much profit? Bwahahaha!

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Lolita

Oct-18-13 4:38 PM

Rocco... New York built a whole City around a very expansive Park that took multi millions to build and run. We are talking about 175 acres. People in this City and those on this venue rail about the costs of the Coral Oaks and Sun Splash that bring in revenue but cost more to run. Thought we didn't have the monies to buy anything says so many, now the same people think the City should pony up $13m or so just for starters,etc. etc. It's common sense. Cost, plus loss of income from the land, plus another cost to run it. Anyone think somebody is going to jump at the chance to run it for free?

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